# Low Oil



## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Yesterday I went out for about 3-4 hours with 2-4 stops, the fan was on a bit more often then it should i thought. I was in garage today and checked my oil it was pretty low, Should it be alright? i put some oil in it but itll need some more(won't be out nextweekend anyway), but will my engine be alright? it wasn't empty but it was pretty low. No smoke, no symptoms other then running a bit hotter then usual.

On a side note, how do you all remember to check these so often? these things suck ALOT of oil in just a few rides and If i keep forgetting its defiantly going to mean trouble.


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

Waddaman said:


> Yesterday I went out for about 3-4 hours with 2-4 stops, the fan was on a bit more often then it should i thought. I was in garage today and checked my oil it was pretty low, Should it be alright? i put some oil in it but itll need some more(won't be out nextweekend anyway), but will my engine be alright? it wasn't empty but it was pretty low. No smoke, no symptoms other then running a bit hotter then usual.
> 
> On a side note, how do you all remember to check these so often? these things suck ALOT of oil in just a few rides and If i keep forgetting its defiantly going to mean trouble.


Well...man I have to tell you that... at least for mine,.. I change it every 500-600 miles or so and it hardly comes off the full mark between changes. So if yours is going through that much, I'd want to know where its going...cause to the most part...it ain't normal.

In the meantime keep it full, check all the seals,keep the aircleaner clean and if you are using synthetic, try conventional. Mine burns synthetics but won't conventionals...wierd...go figure..


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## brute for mud (Jul 15, 2010)

i ran into the same thing during a ride this winter the oil was not on the stick and all is good now i run full synthetic and it has not lost a drop


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## 88rxn/a (Mar 2, 2009)

oil cooler....
gives you a buffer zone and runs cooler.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

I just cleaned my air box completely and put in a uni filter not long ago. No exsesive amounts of oil in the box and i dont wheelie much. The seals on the engine are good only one that leaks is my front diff drive shaft seal, which has nothing to do with it.. But winter did just end here.. I may need synthetic possibly? Bikes got 2550 kms on it and I'm running Kawie mineral oil from dealer...I THINK it's 20w50 but I'm probably wrong I'll check tomorrow. As far as an oil cooler I was thinking about it but I'd rather not drill and tap into my engine. I'd rather fix the problem not remedy it..


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## 88rxn/a (Mar 2, 2009)

no need to drill and tap my friend...get a adapter plate. screws onto stock oil filter location and has a inlet/outlet fittings.


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## Roboquad (Sep 8, 2009)

How about the seal to the water pump. If you ride and that seal is on the way out it could be weeping out when hot. Is there any in the tube under the skid plate???


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

No oil leaking whatsoever from engine while sitting. Could be leaking while hot but If it is it's leaking slowly. I'll check it tomorrow. Mmkawierider how much was it to do your oil filter with all fittings? Also my rad has gotten filled a couple times lately and it was probably running hot but temp light has never came on? Could it be disappearing from being to hot? I'm working on a rad relocate now. My only guess is running hot or i should have semi or full synthetic in it By now. Thing cranks like a beast it just eats alot of oil for some odd reason


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

Waddaman said:


> No oil leaking whatsoever from engine while sitting. Could be leaking while hot but If it is it's leaking slowly. I'll check it tomorrow. Mmkawierider how much was it to do your oil filter with all fittings? Also my rad has gotten filled a couple times lately and it was probably running hot but temp light has never came on? Could it be disappearing from being to hot? I'm working on a rad relocate now. My only guess is running hot or i should have semi or full synthetic in it By now. Thing cranks like a beast it just eats alot of oil for some odd reason


The oil cooler and all the parts came to about 180, but I got special 3000 psi steel armered lines made by my local hydro shop...yeah I know...Overkill...but at least I never have to worry about them. The adaptor was only about 40 bucks and I think I updated my writeup in the How Tos for a new website to get one. 

Strange for any engine to burn conventional oil but not synthetics, its usualy the other way around but stranger things have happened. I'd try just the standard Kawie 10/40 ATV oil at see how se does....and get the radiator cleaned. Hot engines can unseat rings and oil can get by. Has to get pretty hot though.


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## djmjt (Jun 19, 2010)

LOl. True nm from what I've heard but believe it or not mine didn't burn a drop of conventional when I had that in it and doesn't burn or lose a drop of full synthetic. I know what you're saying though, I've heard from multiple sources that they seem to burn through synthetic.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Ive cleaned out my rad after its been clogged full, only rid it for about 45 min max after it was and took breaks. like i said the temp light has never came on. Ill have to do more research on an oil cooler, And also ill research why im burning so much because as of now it makes no sense.


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## Roboquad (Sep 8, 2009)

the reason I suggested the seal at the base was I had that problem long ago...on the 1st engine. would drip on the trail but not a drop in the garage....I caught it with a new plastic line looped up and zip tied. Hope you find it...


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Going to look at it right now.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

The oil im using now is 20W50. As far as leaks, right now i can't see any except for some coming out of my rear cylinder which has been there forever and i was told it was normal.. don't even know if it is from the cylinder but i dont think thats where its going because its been there forever and its not fresh. I checked over the whole thing for oil and i didnt find anything. I may need to wash it off and go for a ride without touching any mud.. to see, but can't see when thats gonna happen because its hasn't been sunny for 3 weeks. but my seals look good.. mud on em not oil..it gets more confusing the more i think about it:thinking:


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

Well, there is onl;y so many places it can go...lets see..;

1. Case seals, gaskets or plugs
2. By the rings and pistons
3. Down the valve guides
4. Sucked up the crankcase vent into the airbox and down the intake

Can't think of anywhere else it can go


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Well, First off i really hope its nothing major and i don't have to take it apart. And this week and the next i will be stripping all my plastics off to redo my snorkels properly and im doing a rad relocate. I will look over the whole thing for any signs of oil. Ill search the net for similar problems. I might even take pics for you guys to look at and see if u can see anything? I know how an engine works in general but not fine detail (ill be taking an Internal Combustion Engines class next year!) if I or We come up with nothing(which i doubt), then ill probably switch to synthetics and possibly an oil cooler if i can sell those grizzly parts and get the money.


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## MinnKawi (Jun 8, 2010)

My 08 burned through Mobil 1 like it was 2-stroke oil when I ran hard lat summer. Just changed to regular oil. We'll see.


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## countryboy61283 (Mar 20, 2010)

I had the exact same problem and mine was valve guide seals and it also was slipping by the rings


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## 88rxn/a (Mar 2, 2009)

valve guide seals:
do they need replaced or just adjust the valves?


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## countryboy61283 (Mar 20, 2010)

Replaced, summer is my down time so I took my motor out to find out what the deal was and discovered that, I sent it to glen at amr


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## brutemike (Mar 23, 2010)

My buddies rex was doing that so he made a catch can and it doesnt do it anymore but thats what he told me so i dont know personaly.


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## countryboy61283 (Mar 20, 2010)

I had a catch can, even tried different oils to see if that helps but oh well, it happens, but that doesn't mean my problem is his to, I would cover all the basic small things and go from there, that's what I did and it finally led me to my valve guides and bad rear cylinder rings


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

I have to revive this thread. Im thinking about trading my brute and It's still losing oil, Id like to know whats wrong with it and if its small I can fix it. Its still the same situation, no leaking oil, no noticeable smoke out the exhaust but lost half the dip stick yesterday. Not in the air box. And still pulls just as good or better then ever. I know weve gone over the options but im hoping there's some bazaar reason because my luck thatd be it. I really don't want to lie to the guy id be trading with but im getting to the point where I have no choice. Its losing a bit of oil but if you tell someone that while trading or selling they would be like swamped,junk,garbage. But its not. I know weve gone over everything in this thread but i don't know where else to turn...


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

Waddaman said:


> I have to revive this thread. Im thinking about trading my brute and It's still losing oil, Id like to know whats wrong with it and if its small I can fix it. Its still the same situation, no leaking oil, no noticeable smoke out the exhaust but lost half the dip stick yesterday. Not in the air box. And still pulls just as good or better then ever. I know weve gone over the options but im hoping there's some bazaar reason because my luck thatd be it. I really don't want to lie to the guy id be trading with but im getting to the point where I have no choice. Its losing a bit of oil but if you tell someone that while trading or selling they would be like swamped,junk,garbage. But its not. I know weve gone over everything in this thread but i don't know where else to turn...


 
I forget...what oil are you running?


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Kawie engine oil 10w40 I believe.


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## freebird_78 (Aug 7, 2011)

Ever consider trying something like:
http://www.valvoline.com/products/consumer-products/motor-oil/higher-mileage-motor-oil/3#b

or 

http://www.bardahl.com/mods/gallery...categoryid=81&text=&imageid=359&box=&shownew=

These are supposed to have additives to make rubber seals "swell" to some degree and help stop leaks (even though you can't seem to find yours). 

Have you pulled the plugs? Being that you're in FI, it's not quite as definitive as poor jetting can throw the look of the plugs off, but pull the plugs and see A) is there any major difference between the two cylinders and B) is there a lot of oily deposits on the electrode.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

I just might do that.. Thanks!


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

Some Brute engines ...mine being one..burn synthetic oils but not conventionals. But you are already on a conventional so... Well, there is only two places to loose oil, out the case through seals and gaskets and...through the combustion chamber. With no leaks I would guess either some weak rings, a good scratch or two in a cylinder or some bad valve seals. No quick-fixes for any of that I'm afraid.....at least.. none I know of.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

I got stuck real bad last weekend in some skeg, but I just noticed what looks like oil on my cases.. Im not sure if it's mud stuck to the case (sprayed off extensively and was not hot when going in, as well as not in real long) Is it possible that it would lose oil from the secondary only while running AND escape the cover without allowing water in? or is this some kinda trick.. Heres pics maybe someone has seen this before. id simply pull my cover off but don't feel like risking breaking them crappy bolts, would like to get some advice first. Also, the rear drive seal shouldn't be leaking as I just replaced it this summer and didn't drive it all that much, took pics of it as i didn't know why it was the same in the back, there not straight on had to fit lens and flash under exhaust.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

This is a pic right after I got stuck in it. see how it was not deep as it wasnt on the clutch cover, just really thick. Too bad I didn't get a picture of the side. The mud on the rear drive shaft maybe was just splashed on by tires? the stuff right under the secondary is much tougher to wipe off.


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

I kinda think is that rear seal again. I'd pull the cover just to be sure but...and might check the crank case vent.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

crank case vent goes to air box? why check that? I dont wheelies that ofter and its not in the air box. I have tomorrow off getting fibre op installed in house, Ill tear it down take pics for ya and stuff.


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## Sanative (May 4, 2011)

Mine does the same, but then i look in the airbox and see oil. One of my "friends", "stole" my brute and held it wide open for about 10 seconds, and wheelied :angryfire:
It brought it down to about half. I topped it off and it's fine now


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

Waddaman said:


> crank case vent goes to air box? why check that? I dont wheelies that ofter and its not in the air box. I have tomorrow off getting fibre op installed in house, Ill tear it down take pics for ya and stuff.


But it comes from the top of the crankcase and sometimes it can come loose or get cracked next to the block.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

k then ill check that too, last time I checked though there was no oil near it.


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

Waddaman said:


> k then ill check that too, last time I checked though there was no oil near it.


Just looking for anywhere oil might come from on the outside. That speed sensor has a seal too...right?


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Im not sure. I thought about that but didn't look. But anyway i said screw it and went outside to check it out, lots of picks and no oil anywhere...
Pic1:no oil on clutches
Pic2: '' '' '' ''
Pic3: Crank case vent air box side, no cracks no oil
Pic4:Attempt as Crank case vent case side, no signs of moisture for what I can see
Pic: coolant seal


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

All pics of coolant inputs/outputs no signs of oil or moisture.

Likely hood of a DSC 840 for Christmas just goin up and up here...


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

Ok...rear seal it is then.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

I wiped the mud off it but ill let it sit over night take it for a run tomorrow morning and see if its leaking at all, but I doubt it. I just replaced it, this is not the reason I have been losing oil. It started losing oil way before the last one started leaking. I check that seal often for oil as they are known to go and it was completely fine before last ride. I think that mud had oil or something in it to make it stick to cases like that.


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

Waddaman said:


> I wiped the mud off it but ill let it sit over night take it for a run tomorrow morning and see if its leaking at all, but I doubt it. I just replaced it, this is not the reason I have been losing oil. It started losing oil way before the last one started leaking. I check that seal often for oil as they are known to go and it was completely fine before last ride. I think that mud had oil or something in it to make it stick to cases like that.


Ok..Just kinda looks like the botton side of the seal and case looks like its cleaner like it has had some oil flow across it. Looks press in too far too. Might be the camera angle.


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## Roboquad (Sep 8, 2009)

Did you check the vent at the bottom of the motor. The oil will sit in the tube without dripping, but sorry out when hot and pressure added.seal is for oil, air and coolant.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

I may have wiped the seal off a bit before the pic I can't remember, its flush with the lip of that plate around the drive shaft output not sure what its called. Ill be checking it any who. Vent on the bottom of the engine, you mean the white funnel looking thing? Ive looked there multiple times and have yet to see anything in it. Its laying on top of my skid plates and I don't see any oil there either. Ill check my speed sensor tomorrow not sure what it uses though.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Lol, I don't know if im right or not because I don't exactly know what the valve seals in these are supposed to look like but. If they are cylinder shape with a tapered cone on top with some orange rings on them, one of em was just chillin on the very top of my valve stem... lol.

Ill get pics tomorrow, how does a valve seal just pop off???


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## Nain (Mar 17, 2010)

My Brute hated the Kawi 10w-40 synthetic. It went through it like crazy for some reason and after only a few rides it would smell like it was burnt and changed color quickly. I Switched to Amsoil 0w-40 for this winter and since I have it's been losing zero oil and staying super clean with no terrible burnt smell.

I wont be putting that Kawi synthetic back in my Brute that's for sure.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

im was running conventional not synthetic tho


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## MinnKawi (Jun 8, 2010)

Mine goes through oil too. Either damaged piston ring or valve guide seal. Rear cylinder. Not enough to warrant the cost of repair. 
Check your oil often. I still check my wifes Brute everytime I ride even though it has never used any.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Everybody should be in the habit of checking it before every ride, If i didn't do that my engine would be gone right now.


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

Waddaman said:


> Everybody should be in the habit of checking it before every ride, If i didn't do that my engine would be gone right now.


I agree. At least check the oil, coolant and gas before every ride.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

And btw yeah it was valve seal sitting at the top of the stem. I was right and dealership was wrong (they said cyl scratch). Now I just hope I can get everything back together without any problems...Im worried about screwing it up already and I don't even get my kit until late Jan/early Feb lol


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