# Clutch spring selection help



## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

(Mods and tires in Sig) I run about 80% trail 20% mud. I blew a belt saturday and it's finally time for clutch springs. I want more low end but I don't want stall and i don't want to lose alot of top end. Im thinking maybe a light primary and a semi-light secondary. I really have not much of a clue about clutches and such so please be tolerant. I also know there's a bunch of other threads on this stuff already but i think im dumb enough on this subject i need special help..lol


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

You 80% trail with 29.5s? You need a red secondary but that will kill your top end. Better do at least an almond. Then to keep your stall down, pink or maroon primary. JMO


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Bootlegger suggested to me maroon primary almond secondary a long time ago, But i don't think it will give me enough low end power for muskeg and peatmoss bog... maybe maroon primary for no stall and step up on the secondary? whats the next secondary spring thats useable with maroon primary?

The percents are just a guess. I mainly trail ride and hit every hole i see, go to bogs sometimes rocky trail all that stuff. my laws run actually really smooth and are amazing in mud.


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

Waddaman said:


> Bootlegger suggested to me maroon primary almond secondary a long time ago, But i don't think it will give me enough low end power for muskeg and peatmoss bog... maybe maroon primary for no stall and step up on the secondary? whats the next secondary spring thats useable with maroon primary?
> 
> The percents are just a guess. I mainly trail ride and hit every hole i see, go to bogs sometimes rocky trail all that stuff. my laws run actually really smooth and are amazing in mud.


Maybe Green, Lime Green...or even Blue. Take a look at the spring chart.


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## Polaris425 (Dec 16, 2004)

I agree I dont think almond is going to do you any good w/ those tires in any muddy condition. I'd stay w/ red or go 1 step under. Or bite the bullet and get VFJ work done.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Im talking with boot now, May go with maroon primary and green secondary. I think red would be way to much for trail riding. And I think i will be getting VFJ work done in the future, but it won't be for a long time.


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## bayou_boy_22 (Mar 13, 2009)

Red or lime green would be my suggestions.


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## JPBrute750 (Apr 27, 2010)

I have a pink primary and green secondary and it is not good at all with my laws. If i dont ride in low i can feel the belt slipping a little every time i take off. I have an almond primary and red secondary on the way.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

I still believe the red is too much. I have to do alot of trail riding to get to any hole. And i want to stay able to do 75 km/h on my speed-O (46Mph) right now with stock springs i top out at 86-90km/h on speed-O. If i do red i know it's going to bring it much farther down then that.


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## Polaris425 (Dec 16, 2004)

I could do about 45-50mph w/ my red & 29's


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Really? 50mph with 29.5 wides with red secondary? what primary? And 50mph Speed-O speed? not actual speed....oh god this is all so confusing:34:


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## RED BRUTE23 (Jul 5, 2011)

man i went with maroon primary and red secondary and its great for trail and the deep mud.....


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Any stall? Top speed? your running backs which are even a bit heavier then mine, so curious what your top speed-O speed is.


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## brutemike (Mar 23, 2010)

I just did the almond primary and red secondary this spring with my 29.5" terms and i can 45 mph with no problem ive even hit almost 60 but didnt want to blow a belt if i pushed it anymore. I think you would be just fine with the red secondary.


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## Polaris425 (Dec 16, 2004)

I had stock primary. But only went hat fast after I switched to 29x10's up front.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Why would you blow a belt with that set up if you went wide open?


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

I still cant really decide on this but i think im going with 

maroon - almond or...
maroon - green or...
maroon - lime green 

I love the mud but im a bit of a speed demon too... This is really bugging me that i cant make up my mind.:aargh4::aargh4::aargh4:

Maroon - almond: i don't think id loose any top end, i might even gain some to turn 29.5's a little easier which would fuel my speed

Maroon - green: would be in between mud and speed

Maroon - Lime green: Would fuel my mud addiction... but hinder my speed


Will maroon and REGULAR green Work well together?


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

I know....just buy all of them and sell the ones you don't like. :rockn:


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## Polaris425 (Dec 16, 2004)

^ that's exactly what he's gonna have to do! Haha


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

I don't have the money i have one shot at this, and im gonna have to borrow the dealerships clutch pulling tool and spring compressor tool...and i can't sell them no one around here would buy em.


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

Waddaman said:


> I don't have the money i have one shot at this, and im gonna have to borrow the dealerships clutch pulling tool and spring compressor tool...and i can't sell them no one around here would buy em.


Then my best suggestion is to go with whatever Bootlegger said. You will like the best.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Maroon Primary Almond Secondary it is then.. I just hope it's enough so i don't smoke my belt so easily.


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## 08GreenBrute (Jul 13, 2009)

i had an maroon/almond and i dont think its enough for 29.5's but boot has messed with more springs than i have so im sure he knows what he is talking about lol
i now run the maroon/green and like it a lot better for my set up


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

I thought it wouldn't be enough for 29.5's either thats why im so..confused. I guess maroon and almond will be good for now. itll let me keep my speed atleast, i will have to change my springs after Christmas or so anyway, waiting for 32" outlaw 2's...


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## 2domn8 (Dec 29, 2010)

call v-force john


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## brute for mud (Jul 15, 2010)

i have heard that maroon and lime green is not a good combo has a weird rev to it i guess


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

brute for mud said:


> i have heard that maroon and lime green is not a good combo has a weird rev to it i guess


Heard that too. Funny that for several years I used this maroon primary with the Red secondary with 27s. Mostly trails and climbing. A little overkill, but it works fine. Top end was only about 52. After dropping to these 26s I went to this Dalton Violet which is a lot like the Almond. Works better for trails & climbs and got 8mph back on the top end.


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## Brute650i (Dec 17, 2008)

I personally like the almond with 29.5 it has plenty of low end to pull the 29.5 but you have to put it in low as you should regardless of running almond or red. i personally think the stock is enough if you know how to ride without blowing a belt and be smart about it.

just my 2cents


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

Brute650i said:


> I personally like the almond with 29.5 it has plenty of low end to pull the 29.5 but you have to put it in low as you should regardless of running almond or red. i personally think the stock is enough if you know how to ride without blowing a belt and be smart about it.
> 
> just my 2cents


I agree...and this Dalton Violet is what Dalton recomends for 29"+ tires and its close to an Almond so... No matter what you use, gota be smart about it and know when to be in low.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Always in low, only reason i smoked er was because if i didn't get 1 of the 2 guys stuck out we would have been in big doo-doo. Anyway.. $85 for maroon primary and almond secondary...


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

Waddaman said:


> Always in low, only reason i smoked er was because if i didn't get 1 of the 2 guys stuck out we would have been in big doo-doo. Anyway.. $85 for maroon primary and almond secondary...


Man...shipping must be a killer. 24.95 each on the EPI site


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Ordered through a company near me that picks em up over the border too. I can't even order them to my door just says no shipping method available.. :thinking:


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## vogie (Jun 16, 2010)

I know money is tight but it's probably best to experiment on spring combos till you find one you enjoy driving with. Every person has different riding styles, I've gone through 3 different spring combos and just ordered a 4th lol.

I'm guessing you'd be fine with the Green Secondary/Almond Primary. This has a very peppy feel to it the only downfall is thick peanut butter mud or technical riding, it will eat your belt like nothing if you are light on the throttle for extended periods.

If you can live without the peppy feel or you do a lot of technical/thick mud riding then the Almond Secondary/Maroon Primary could be fine.

Just my thoughts from a fellow Canuck!


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## Zwhit23 (Jul 14, 2011)

I just put 30 sbacks on mine its a 08 ive heard the 08's are different than the 07 model's whats some suggestions to what i have they are 10's all the way around


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## Sanative (May 4, 2011)

Yeah if i went with anything i was probably going to go almond primary/red secondary. I just want a bunch of low end and 50-55 is probably the fastest i'd go. I've been running stock clutching with my 29.5x10's for about a month, it stays in low and i haven't had a problem


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## Polaris425 (Dec 16, 2004)

Zwhit23 said:


> I just put 30 sbacks on mine its a 08 ive heard the 08's are different than the 07 model's whats some suggestions to what i have they are 10's all the way around


nothing different about the clutches, they're all the same. read through the clutching section in the kawi how-to section. you'll get all your answers.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Quick question. Can o run stock primary with almond secondary?


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

Waddaman said:


> Quick question. Can o run stock primary with almond secondary?


Sure. I just swaped-out my Maroon primary for the stock and left in my Dalton in the secondary. Works good....for me anyway.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Nvm thought you needed tool to get primary spring out. Is there anyway to get the belt out without taking the primary off? Or is there anyway to get the secondary out without removing belt??? Have a compression tool no primary remover...


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Hillbilly ways excepted too. Needa way to get this off


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

Waddaman said:


> Nvm thought you needed tool to get primary spring out. Is there anyway to get the belt out without taking the primary off? Or is there anyway to get the secondary out without removing belt??? Have a compression tool no primary remover...


You don't need to pull the primary to replace that spring...in fact, many say you have to take the bolt out but it looks like the cover will come off over the bolt and washers so...I'll have to try that next time just to see. Just take the 10mm bolts out of the cover and you can change the spring. Its not compressed much so don't sweat it. Be sure the arrow on the spider and the one on the cover are together when you put it back on.

I have had pretty good luck taking the belt off without pulling either clutch but its a ..b**ch to put it back without stressing the belt or the clutches so...better to do it per the book. Others will tell you to just roll it on and off but Kawie says don't...so. 

My suggestion is: as a Brute owner, you will need a primary puller, a spring compressor and a torque wrench. Might as well get what you need.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Already have primary in. Really wanna figure out a way to get this off. And get it back togeather. Could be a while before I can get a pulley too... Tried the secondary roll thing.. It's a new belt no way it will stretch it's much to hard.


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## filthyredneck (Feb 10, 2010)

I think you may be able to pull the secondary off, slip the belt over the primary, and then put it on the secondary....probably require alot of cussin to get the secondary back over to the shaft to bolt back up but may be possible....


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

filthyredneck said:


> I think you may be able to pull the secondary off, slip the belt over the primary, and then put it on the secondary....probably require alot of cussin to get the secondary back over to the shaft to bolt back up but may be possible....


Yeah I think if you can sink the belt into the shives a bit by parting them some it wouldn't be too bad at all....and a couple of ..adult beverages.. wouldn't hurt either..


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Already tried that.. kind of. Don't want to mess up the splines on the secondary though, or get it stuck... but ill try it again. and can't part the secondary.. no room to get in there and if so would end up gouging them.


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

Waddaman said:


> Already tried that.. kind of. Don't want to mess up the splines on the secondary though, or get it stuck... but ill try it again. and can't part the secondary.. no room to get in there and if so would end up gouging them.


Yeah and there is only one way it will go on...and I have a hard enough time with it putting both on at the same time...lol


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## filthyredneck (Feb 10, 2010)

nmkawierider said:


> Yeah and there is only one way it will go on...and I have a hard enough time with it putting both on at the same time...lol


LOL....YOU TOO???? And I thought I was the only one!


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## NMKawierider (Apr 11, 2009)

filthyredneck said:


> LOL....YOU TOO???? And I thought I was the only one!


Yeah even when I put it on first and put the keyway straight up and mark it...and put it in gear so it won't move...it just has to F with me at least once...lol


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Got it! Clamped the belt down between the pri and sec until it touched, it pushed itself far enough into the secondary, we held the bottom so it would stay deeper in the secondary, then we slowly rolled it out. and yes the secondary was stock. gotta wait until tomorrow to test it.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Got another question, running maroon Pri and Almond Sec and ive got black marks all over the outer edge of my primary like its not reaching it? Only a maroon primary it should still make it to the top shouldn't it? the ring is about 3/4"... Maybe the 840 will solve this, or maybe my new belt needs a shim removed. Didn't when I put it on not sure why it would now...


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

^^^ Bump?


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## nathen53 (Jun 13, 2011)

Sorry I cant answer your question but I would like to know how you like the maroon and almond with the outlaws. I have read this thread and saw u posted you still wanna be able to go fast which sounds exactly like me. So how fast will it go with these springs and do you like it better than the stock springs?


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

It gave me a little more belt grip and let me keep pretty much all my top speed, as far as low end its definitely better than stock. I had it doing high 80km/h and it still had a bit more with 2" snorks, dynojet jetkit, moose module and full big gun exhaust. It had more in it, but going that fast with completely unbalanced mud tires like that is ridiculous you have NO control. On pavement handle bars were moving 45 degrees each way about every half second on there own, it is a bit better on dirt but still dangerous. Overall I wish I went with maybe a green for a little bit more belt grip and low end, but maroon/almond is definitely better than stock.

Anyway, Ive got pics of primary and secondary. Im thinking I have to remove a shim from secondary...


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## 2010Bruterider (Jun 20, 2010)

Your belt deflection looks real good. Mine runs just a hair higher in the secondary though. And that's about normal on your primary too. The belt doesn't run all the way out to the edge of the primary sheives. I don't think the primary can physically close up that far. Enjoy the new clutch. If you get those 32's, you're gonna want to talk to VFJ, without question.


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## Waddaman (Oct 3, 2010)

Really? that's normal? Im taking the primary off to time my cams for the 840 Ill see if it actually doesn't close that far. And the bigger tires gotta wait, doin the 840 now and next on the list is muzzy super pro and dyna CDI. Then front axles and tie rods because the 840 will probably smash stock parts, then HL springs new 2" lift and winch cause mines crap THEN some 31" laws and VFJ work or whatever is out by then!


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## 2010Bruterider (Jun 20, 2010)

Wow! You've got some list. That all sounds cool man, keep us updated on your struggles. It's always worth it in the end.


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