# Best way to get some more Power!!



## 08GreenBrute (Jul 13, 2009)

I'm looking to get some more power lol. is the difference in compression on the 650's the heads or pistons and would i be better to swap them or just get some other brand piston and cams? 

also i got the MSD and i cant tell all that much difference from stock. i noticed that the box says teryx on it is this the right MSD?

is there anything else i can do besides piston/cams? i haven't researched any of this yet so its all new to me, the help is appreciated


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## Brute650i (Dec 17, 2008)

You would be better off getting some amr pistons and cams. I can get you a complete setup for $900if your interested


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## 08GreenBrute (Jul 13, 2009)

What is in the kit? Also what compression and cam set up would you recommend if I want to stay on pump gas and still be able to cruise/trail ride reliably


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## J2! (May 8, 2010)

Anything over 12:1 and you can't run pump gas anymore. I have his 12:1's in mine and I run pump gas, it just has to be 93 octane or higher. Alot of times I will just mix half 93 and half 112 together and it does great. The kit will have pistons, rings and cams. All you need is some of his 1X drop in cams. If you go to the 2X, you will have to buy stiffer valve springs also, about $100 for kibblewhites. And you'll also have to get some base and head gaskets too. Some 1X drop in's will really wake it up. You can get any compression you want 10.5:1, 11:1. etc. For comparison the stock pistons are 8.5:1.


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## Brute650i (Dec 17, 2008)

I would go 12:1 on premium pump gas with 2x cams. The $900 includes rings, pistons, clips, cams and valve springs. 

You should have no problems with this kit for trail riding.


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## 08GreenBrute (Jul 13, 2009)

That's all pretty much bolt in correct no machining? I've got 800 miles on my bike never swamped anything else I should to while I have it down? One more thing brute650i does that kit have gaskets


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## Roboquad (Sep 8, 2009)

Mill the heads... 20 one thousands is maxed out but a cheap way to change compression. Port and polish will also help. If you want more I have to agree with above. Your cylinder walls are nikasil. Not able to port without a sleeve.


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## filthyredneck (Feb 10, 2010)

Just outta curiousity... Where are you really wanting this extra power? Low end, top end, or just all the way around? 
And if you get a engine kit, definitely keep below 12:1 like recommended. I've run 11.5:1 in mine for more than a year now and its been very reliable, I do run 93 octane because it runs weird on anything less.


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## 08GreenBrute (Jul 13, 2009)

Im looking towards the low end. Top end isn't that big of a deal


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## J2! (May 8, 2010)

If you get the standard bore kit it will not require any machine work, just hone out the cylinders. Like Robo said, a port and polish will help ALOT but you need to get someone that REALLY knows what they are doing to do it or you can do more damage than good if it's not done right. It can get kinda expensive too. If I remember right, Glenn at AMR charges $600 to do it but it's VERY professionally done. The best I have seen. And WELL worth the money if you have the other mods to support it.


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## Brute650i (Dec 17, 2008)

No gaskets come with the kit. Pretty much a bolt in kit other than fitting the rings


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## 08beast (Sep 10, 2009)

Would ya'll recommend honing the cylinder or not. I've had a couple ppl tell me not to and then a few say to do it. If the cylinder is not damaged wouldn't you be just taking out wall thickness, or is the wall thickness a good sacrafice to have the cross hatch to better set the rings to the cylinder?

I'm getting ready to order the std bore with 2x cams for mine so hopfully its well worth the money.


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## wyo58 (May 13, 2011)

I seem to remember that the brutes are nickasealed (spelling), which means if you do hone them you better know what your doing. But i've been wrong many times before, just ask my wife lol.


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## filthyredneck (Feb 10, 2010)

08GreenBrute said:


> Im looking towards the low end. Top end isn't that big of a deal


 
This is kinda what I figured. Have you given any thought to the Teryx Gear Swap? Not trying to talk you out of spending a grand on a motor build, but just throwing it out there. You can buy the gears at a little over $200 if you shop for the lowest price. I actually lucked out when I did mine and picked up a brand new gear set off of one of the local builders around here for $80 because he ordered it for a customer and they never came and picked it up. The how-to looks difficult, but it is one of the simplest mods I've ever done and it did make a noticeable difference in low for sure. With my heavy 31 Laws I can stand it on the back rack with a blip of the throttle from a dead stop.... Your tire weight should be less...plus they are a size smaller, which would make me think you'd feel it even more than what I do. Anybody correct me if I'm wrong. ...And it didn't murder my top end either, I can still run a touch over 30 in low, havn't bothered to try riding in high yet...just dont need to where I ride.


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## kawboy1 (Aug 25, 2010)

I would def hone the cyl, just make sure you use the correct hone for nik cyl......not one that has been used on non nik cyl. With the motor kit you will pretty much double your HP depending on tune and other mods. Well worth it.


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## 88rxn/a (Mar 2, 2009)

so $900 for the kit and prob close to that for the install?


oh man....


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## kawboy1 (Aug 25, 2010)

Dont know what it would cost for someone to install but it aint rocket science if you have a manual, tools and are mechanicly inclined. Easy D.I.Y job just get a shop to install valve springs if ya dont have the tool for that.


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## Brute650i (Dec 17, 2008)

to get someone else to do it your probably looking at around $1500-1800 parts and labor


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## Roboquad (Sep 8, 2009)

As far as the nikasil cylinder. Only hone if damaged, easy to screw them up. Have a machine shop do it. Everyone I've ever spoken to about it says do not. Have you looked for 06 heads? Steel, easy to bore. Your port and polish will give you the most low end snot for next to nothing.


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## blue beast (Feb 16, 2010)

can you port and polish the heads on a stock motor and it make a difference...dont know much about it..is why i ask ...would it be worth it to do


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## J2! (May 8, 2010)

Port and polish on a stock motor is a waste of money, it won't make much difference unless you have the other mods to support it, pistons, cams, pipe, etc.


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## 08beast (Sep 10, 2009)

Thanks fellas, guess i'll just wait and take a visual inspection to see if there is any damage. Cause i don't know any better can typically any machine shop port and polish the heads or does it take a speciality shop? And what's a rough price on it?


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## J2! (May 8, 2010)

Like I posted earlier in the thread, Glenn charges $600 to do it but it's the best work I have seen yet. A local shop might do them a little cheaper but they won't spend as much time on detail as he would. A bad port job can actually rob you of hp if it's not done right. So do your homework before you let someone do it. Good luck with it !!


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## 08beast (Sep 10, 2009)

:34:my bad read right over that J2. Guess i'll just skip over that step in the rebuild.


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## 08GreenBrute (Jul 13, 2009)

Thanks for all the responses, if i can quit spending money on mods for this dang RZR lol ill start on the Brute. anyway has anyone noticed if there MSD is for a brute or a Teryx or if it even matters?


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## Roboquad (Sep 8, 2009)

*yes*. I did mine with a dremel tool...machine shop guy looking over my shoulder and giving me pointers. you can do it yourself but do not go too far. If you send them out you will get the most out of them but I noticed a BIG dif. off the line.. also get the valve seals changed while the heads are out.... you need to find a local machine shop. 10 min job with the right tools.


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## jrfonte (Mar 9, 2010)

08greenbrute: the msd is for the terex but works just fine on the 08^ 750 brutes


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## 08GreenBrute (Jul 13, 2009)

^^ok thanks i just wanted to make sure i had the right one lol.


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## 88rxn/a (Mar 2, 2009)

so lets say,
pistons
cams
port & polish
what kind of numbers does this give? im curious what average people gain? instead of seat of the pants numbers, does anyone have dyno graphs or know what HP you gained?


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## J2! (May 8, 2010)

88rxn/a said:


> so lets say,
> pistons
> cams
> port & polish
> what kind of numbers does this give? im curious what average people gain? instead of seat of the pants numbers, does anyone have dyno graphs or know what HP you gained?


Pistons, cams, and port and polish will at least double your hp from stock. I don't have any dyno sheets on my 840, Extreme Racing in Lucedale would not give me a graph on it, but there are ALOT of them posted on KR to prove the results from these mods. On my bike, when it was stock it dynoed at 28 rwhp, with a dynatek cdi, hmf, it dynoed at 39 rwhp. Now with the 840 kit, I'm pushing right at 75 "rwhp" so at the crank it would be somewhere around 100 hp or mid 90's, you loose about 30% as it goes through the drivetrain.


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## Brute650i (Dec 17, 2008)

Sticky at top of kawi section has a lot of graphs.


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## 88rxn/a (Mar 2, 2009)

thanks!
what is the involvement on changing out cams and pistons? does the motor have to come out? just the top end has to come off for the pistons and just pop out the pin and replace the piston?
what about the cams?
if anyone has a link or even a video it would be greatly app!


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## J2! (May 8, 2010)

88rxn/a said:


> thanks!
> what is the involvement on changing out cams and pistons? does the motor have to come out? just the top end has to come off for the pistons and just pop out the pin and replace the piston?
> what about the cams?
> if anyone has a link or even a video it would be greatly app!


Yes the motor would definitely have to come out. You'll have to remove the heads, jugs, etc. to get to the cams. Not sure if you'll find a video of it or not. Look in the Kawi how-to section, I'm sure there is something in there to help. Just a standard bore kit will really wake it up from stock.


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## kawboy1 (Aug 25, 2010)

Unless I missed something and you are needing to split the cases for some reason the motor DOES NOT have to come out to do pistons and cams.

You simply need to remove the top end ie tappet covers, cams, heads, barrels and remove piston pin clips, pop out the pins, remove the pistons and re assemble with the new parts.

You can get the manual from on here and it will tell you everything you need to know. It's a pretty simple job if you are mech inclined.


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## 88rxn/a (Mar 2, 2009)

motor is fine mechanically, im just getting the itch for more power. i do have a carb 750 manual im going to look at and see. i was hoping for tricks/tips people have learned and shared somewhere to make it easier and faster.
id like to think im mechanically inclined, ive never done it before but i cant think of it as being to complicated.


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## J2! (May 8, 2010)

Hmmm, the Brutes must have ALOT more room in them than the kitties then, because on mine you can get the front one off but there is NO way the back one will come off without pulling the motor, just not enough room to get it apart and take the head off. I have tried and so has my dealer. But I WAS refering to my cat and assumed the Brutes are the same way.:thinking: Guess ya learn something new every day.


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## kawboy1 (Aug 25, 2010)

88rxn/a said:


> motor is fine mechanically, im just getting the itch for more power. i do have a carb 750 manual im going to look at and see. i was hoping for tricks/tips people have learned and shared somewhere to make it easier and faster.
> id like to think im mechanically inclined, ive never done it before but i cant think of it as being to complicated.


It's an easy enough job. Make sure you start with the bike spotless clean, remove plastics, drain fluids etc. Remove spark plugs and stator cover, tappet covers(there is a hidden bolt on the inside under the small valve inspection cover)make sure you get that one on each cyl.

Remove tensioners, slip the chain off the cams and remove cams, hang the chains with a bungee strap or wire so they dont drop down into the cases. 

The rear cam is diff to the front and has a groove running around it so note that and your new cams will be the same. Swap over the cam sprockets/decomp to the new cams. Remove the cyl and pistons. 

Clean all surfaces and remove any traces of old gaskets, it's a good idea to have clean shop towels stuffed into the cases so you don't get anything down there inc the piston pin clips! 

Then put everything back in reverse. When you get to installing the new cams get the rear piston on TDC install the rear cam with all the timing marks lined up then turn the motor clockwise 270 deg to TDC on the front cyl and install the front cam.

Don't let the motor idle when you first start it up for at least 15-20 min you need to keep the revs up to run the new cams in, oh and make sure you put plenty of cam lube on those cams when you install.

Run a tank of gas thru it and drop the oil. Thats about it, don't think I left anything important out lol.


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## 88rxn/a (Mar 2, 2009)

doesn't sound bad at all, the timing bothers me though. i wish i could watch a video how to set the timing, then id start saving knowing i can do this easily.

and sorry for hi jacking the thread.


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## kawboy1 (Aug 25, 2010)

The timing bothers a lot of people but don't let it. It's simple and if you do what I described above you will have zero problems.

The trouble people mainly have with cams and timing is 1. They put the cams in 180 deg off but do what I said above and it wont happen. 2. They get the front and rear cam mixed up.

You will wonder what you worried about.....I have more trouble trying to slip the new pistons and rings into the barrel than what I have with cams and timing lol.


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